This workshop lists all the data we can find about
David of Rott and his childern, including Philip,
and David's grandchildern as they traveled from Rott to Lancaster, PA, to Maryland, and then, we think to VA and NC. Eventually, we may have some VA and NC data on this page because our goal is to show the migrations of this family to other states. We also want to place on this page anything we can learn about David's family before they left Alsace and details of how they traveled to get to America and their migrations in America.
Edited by Harold Eddleman, Descendant of Catherine Eddleman, KY 1778
As far as European origins, keep in mind also that David Edelman, his son Philip Jacob, and their families came from the Alsace (Steinselz-Cleeberg areas). This family came to Lancaster Co., Pa., then to Baltimore (now Carroll) Co., Md. They may very well be the ancestors of the Catherine Eddleman family of Kentucky (1778), since a John David was born to Philip Jacob in Lancaster at about the right time. A David and Catherine Edelman had at least one child born there and later appear in Md. This (as far as I know) is the most likely candidate for your Catherine, although (as you know) we lack documentation. I am not sure where this family resided before the Alsace, but possibly in Switzerland. There are many Edelman records in Canton Basel and the St. Gallen area. I wonder if the surname originated in only one area and spread with emigration, or if the surname originated in several areas in northern Europe. Maybe in time we can answer this question. Well, until later. ----Bill .. 1997 September 2. Later Bill wrote that he has many Edelmann names in Switzerland but no documentation to trace whether any might have migrated to Alsace.
This was the keynote message of Bill Eddleman on EDDLEMAN-L that got this workshop started. Bill @ SEMO as I like to call him for quick identification is the current Dean of Edemann Genealogists taking over where Pioneers William H. Eddleman and his Uncle Riley Eddleman left off when they were taken from us. -- Harold Eddleman, Editor.
Some lineages from Hanss David Edelmann zu Rott/Elsass
The above links take you to biographic pages which were under construction, but I have discontinued work on those pages so that all the information on all three men and their families and related familes will be on this page. You only need to study this page. Rott was very near Steinseltz. This area was under a German ruler when the Edelmann and Bousser families left for America.
1882 map of Alsace - Press this Link (planned, I have lost the URL) to see an 1882 map of Alsace (is shows fewer villages). The map link below allows you to zoom in on Rott, Rott, Steinseltz, Oberhoffen, Hunspach, Hoffen, Ingllsheim, Birlenbach, and Keffenach, and other villages mentioned by Paster Pfrimmer.
Steinselz - This modern map shows location of Steinselz in relation to France and Germany including the Odenwald. Notice Beerfelden is in the upper right. John Edelmann's Bruno came from the region 40 miles off the upper right corner of this map.
Rott Region - This is a Zoom in from the above map. It shows Rott and Steinseltz in relation to the Pfalz and Black Forest of Germany.
Rott closeup - This is a closer zoom-in from the above map and shows Rott, Steinseltz, Cleeburg in detail.
The last three maps are from MapQuest.com. If MapQuest comes online again, this URL should furnish an entirely satisfactory map for studying all our German origins. You would be able to move around and view any region of Europe as closely as you wish.
Bill Eddleman has much data on Switzerland, but we have no info whether any of these Swiss emigrated into Germany. William H. Eddleman did some study of Swiss movements into Germany, but I have not seen those pages. I don't think he did much work on the Swiss.
Rick Heli's History of Alsace with a bibliography.
Another biobliography of Alsace history This paper mainly considers the period 1871 - 1918.
David Edelmann of Rott, Alsace, came to America with his family, arriving in Philadelphia on 1733 Sep 28, on the ship Richard and Elizabeth. In ___ they were living at Lancaster, PA. David's son Philip Jakob Edelmann was found in Maryland in 17__. where his son was born. Philip had many land transactions in Maryland in years 17__, 17__, Philip's son David ___ land in 1763 just 2 years before a David Edelmann appears in NC church records. We do not have a documented trail of this David to NC, but David is a rare name among Germans except in the David zu Rott Clan. One son of Philip zu Rott may have changed his last name to Addleman and Robert Paul Addleman, one of his descendants, published a book on this branch of the family.
I. Hans David Eddleman, b. 1684 calc. Citizen of Rott (a village near Steinseltz in Alsace) His wife was Anna Margaretha ___; Did she die before the family came to America? Childern of the above couple - all born in Europe 1. Philip Jakob, b. ~1708; see IIA 2. Anna Elizabeth bp. 1713 May 13; see IIB 3. Maria Ursela, bp. 1716 Sep 6 4. a dau ___, b. 1718 June 9; bp. 1718 June 11;
IIA. Phillip Jakob Edelmann son of David Edelmann of Rott, married Maria Margaretha Wenner on 1732 Jan 15; the dau of Simon Wenner of Oberhoffen (a nearby village) Zweibrucken Manumissions Protocoll, Cleeburg, 1733, show David and Phillip Edelmann move with wives and childern to Pennsylvania 1733 Sep 28 shiplist of Richard and Elizabeth show families of David and Phillip Edelmann debarking at Philadelphia 1733 Sep 28 At Philadelphia courthouse aforesaid appear before The Honorable Lt. Governor and several Magistrates. Forty three Palatines (adult males), who with their families, making in all One hundred Thirty seven persons, were imported here in, Briganteen Richard & Elizabeth of Philadelphia, Christopher Clymer, Master from Rotterdam, but last of Plymouth, as by clearance thence, 17xx Lancaster, PA notes on MD Childern of Phillip and Margaretha 1. ----- 2. ------ to be continued.
IIB. Anna Elizabeth Eddleman bp. 1713 May 13; married Matthew Bausser in Alsace
This data was from Bill Eddleman compiled from Burgert's book and translations of church rcords by Rev Kastens hired by Dr. Riley Eddleman]
The data below this line is as received; above is the trial family histories for your evaluation.
Pennsylvania German Folklore Society Vol 1: (1936). A List of German Immigrants to the American Colonies from Zweibrücken in the Palatinate (1728-1749). Bavarian State Archives, Speyer, Germany, Zweibrücken 111, 2055.
page 107 - Oberamt, Bergzabern, Cleeberg. 1731: Hans Adam Edelmann of Rott leaves the country. 1733: David and Philip Edelman, Michael Hammer, and Peter Scheib of Seinselz with wives and childern for America.
Pennsylvania German Pioneers. Vol 1, Published 1934 by Pennsylvania German Society. A list of the passengers imported in the Brigantine, Richard and Elizabeth, Captain Christopher Clymer, 1733 Sep 28. List of the adult males arriving on of this ship. This list of males is also located below on this page in color code. Partial list of passengers:
in part Philip Jacob Edelman Age 25 Mattes Bouser age 63 David Edelman " 49 Matthes Bowser " 22 Anna Maria Edelman " 54 Margaretha Edelman " 26 Esther Bowser " 49 Baltazar Edelman " 4 Anna Elizabeth (nee Edelmann) Bowser " 20
Bousser is the spelling found in the church records
These ages suggest David may be the father of
Philip Jacob, but these could all be siblings or cousins. What you think?
How can we determine? There have been instances where pastor notes have
resolved such questions. Does anyone have access to any church records
related to these families?
Records of First Reformed Church of Lancaster, Pennsylvania. Births:
1737 John David Edelman s. of Jacob; b. Dec 1, 1730; bapt. May 15, 1737
1739 Anna Margret, dau. of Matthew Bauser and Anna Elizabeth Edelman baptised May 12, 1739 shows Bauser is correct spelling
1739 David son of Mathew Bauser and Anna Eliz. Edelman, bapt. May12,1739 shows wife of Mathew Bauser was an Edelman maybe dau of David of Steinseltz. It also appears that this family did not use the Edelmann nn spelling
Insert here other records of the above church to aid our study.
In 1957, William H. Eddleman, recognized Anna Elizabeth Bowers was a member of the Divid of Rott family. He learned this from church records in PA.
Pastor Theo Pfrimmer, Cleebourg, Bas-Rhin, France wrote to William H. Eddleman on 1957 Sep 23, "(The search could) be a little difficult because there have been many wars here since 1750. In 1945 Rott was almost completely destroyed. The situation is as follows: during the Thirty Years' War, Rott, Steinseltz, Oberhoffen, Hunspach, Hoffen, Ingllsheim, Birlenbach, and Keffenach were totally destroyed. At that time they were under Swedish control. Only a few of the inhabitants came back after the Peace of Westphalia. The other people were replaced by Swiss and by Hugenots who had been expelled by Louis XIV. (It is) my opinion the family comes either from the few survivors or from Switzerland because the family name is typical German." (WHE letter of 1959 Mar 4 directs Pastor Pfrimmer to look for 1680 - 1750 records in Rott and Steinselz and any nearby villages, but I have not found any reply or results from Pfrimmer.)
It seems pretty certain that Matthew Bauser (Bowser) married Anna Elizabeth Edelman (as teenagers) in Europe before they came to America, based on birth records of First Reformed Church of Lancaster, PA, as quoted above.
born 1708 calc perhaps in Rott, Alsace, if family was living there then.
about 1750 moved to Maryland says Bill Eddleman
Check at your libraries, Family History Centers, and other resources for the following. With time we can make these questions more specific.
1. Records of the First Reformed Church of Lancaster, PA, for Eddleman, Bowser, etc.
2. All Pennsylvania German books and websites for Eddleman and Bowser.
Steinselz is rock salt.
Alsace was then under German control. Constant warring depopulated this land many times.
Rott and Steinselz are adjacent villages.
| INDIANA BIOLAB Home Page | PageList
| Claude Eddleman Farm Home Page |
| Farms Around the World | Eddleman Directory | Indiana Biolab Farm Page |
| Speculations about Potential Eddleman Linkages |
Suggestions, corrections, and comments are appreciated: Contact Harold Eddleman email@example.com
RICHARD & ELIZABETH list of the adult males arriving on this ship
[Thanks to Russ Van Esperen for this list]
At the Courthouse aforesaid September 28th, 1733 Present: The Honourable the Lt. Governor and Severals of the Magistrates. Forty three Palatines, who with their families, making in all One hundred Thirty seven persons, were imported here in, Briganteen Richard & Elizabeth of Philadelphia, Christopher Clymer, Master from Rotterdam, but last of Plymouth, as by clearance thence, were qualified as before, and their names are:
Frantz Schuller, Hans Peter Somey, Jacob Grib, Hans Jacob Somey, David
Mertz, Hans Peter Somey Jr., Hans Michael Mertz, Otto Fredrick Somey, Gerorge
Leap, Joseph Shumaker, Johan Conrad, Leap Ulrick Burghalter, Philip
Jacob Edelman, Johan Nicol. Segar, Matthias
Bousser, George Schenemansgruber, Matthias
Bousser Jr., Matthias Beck, Philip Mire, Jhoammes Wollett, Christian
Bousser, Henry Winterberger, David Edelman,
Hans Sherer, Adam Spohn, Jacob Krist, Jacob Hennel, Marcus Krist, Michael
Wise, George Angsted, Johan George Shufard, Marcus Bigler, Johan Yost,
Heck Philip Duderman, Jacob Huntsider, Johannes Weber, Hans Jacob Lebegood,
Johannes Rosensteel, Jacob Herman, Abraham Wootring, Hans Jacob Uts, Matthias
Rehsh, Hans Jurk Uts,
Names in blue may be related to Edelmann, as relatives, close friends, or marriage, or godparents later in America.
Subject: David and Philip Edelman Date: 22 Sep 97
From: EDDLEMAN-L@rootsweb.com (Bill Eddleman)
A couple of tidbits in relation to Harold's request for information. This family is discussed in a book that is relatively recent, "Eighteenth Century Emigrants from the Alsace" by Annette Burkert. I will get the complete reference and material contained therein and post it to the group tomorrow.
Recently, I posted a query to one of the lists I take requesting more information on David and his son Filb (Phillip) Jacob. I got several more pieces of information that suggest even more that this family moved across the Maryland border around 1750. I would like to have the time to follow up on some of these clues (deeds, etc.) before I post them.
Another source I have on this family is Robert Addleman's book on the Addleman family. All the Addlemans in the U.S. apparently descend from Hans Michael Addleman or Daniel Addleman. It appears Daniel originally spelled his name Edelman and some evidence suggests he may be from the Phillip line (possibly a son). This family (Daniel) later moved to Virginia.
Harold, after my Uncle Riley passed away, I ended up with another copy of the Addleman book. I have thought I might give it to a library, but it might be more useful to send it to you. Do you want it? Robert details all the ship's passenger list arrivals (although not the complete lists) for Edelmans and tries to follow up on their locations, and also includes some Pa. records.
Dear Harold, The WHE papers do have some information on Maryland research. What are you looking for? A quick review shows a mention of a number of Edelmans ie Johann, Daniel, David, Catharina, Elisabeth and others. For instance, records for the Reformed and Lutheran Congregation at Manchester, Baltimore County, Md. (now Carroll County) lists a Anna Maria Edelman daughter of David and Catharina Edelman, baptised about 3/7/1762, sponsors Friederich Decker and Anna Maria.The records of the Lutheran Church, Frederick County, Md. lists a baptism of Elisabeth Edelman daughter of Daniel Edelmann and wife Elizabeth born 17 Nov. 1771, sponsors Jacob Schaffer and Maria Deckerin. This -in ending means young female; her name is Maria Decker. There are also mention of Revolutionary War records of Maryland, Archives of Maryland which mention a Michael Edelman. In the Baptism records of Zion Reformed Church, Hagerstown Md. reference is made to Adam Edelman and wife Eva being sponsers for Joseph, son of Peter Binckel and Elizabeth.There is mention of Phillip Edelman in 1758 in Carroll County and Phillip Adleman in the same time frame. Recall Bill Eddleman said a son of the Steinselz family may have adopted the "Adlemann" spelling. Harold Eddleman wonders if he may have adopted this spelling to avoid confusion with Philip Edelmann of Rott. People did that in those days. I will be glad to copy the material and send it to you. Please give me your mailing address as I may have misplaced it.
Subject: David & Catherine Eddleman Date: 23 Sep 97 16:47:08 -0500 From: EDDLEMAN-L@rootsweb.com To: Indbio
Just had a thought. Several of my ancestors left Pa. to emigrate to N. Car. in the 18th century. Oftentimes, their departure corresponded to the death of a parent of one spouse. Perhaps we should look in Baltimore Co., Md. for estate records of Philip Eddleman sometime between 1762, when a David & Catherine had a daughter baptised in Md., and 1765, when a David & Catherine appear as sponsors for a baptism in N. Car.
Subject: David & Filb Jacob Edelman Date: 23 Sep 97 15:19:52 -0500 From: EDDLEMAN-L@rootsweb.com To: Indbio
Yesterday I threatened to post some records on David Edelman of Zweibrucken, so here goes. The following is partly from "Eighteenth Century Emigrants from the Northern Alsace to America" by Annette Kunselman Burgert (1992, Picton Press, Camden, Maine). This book has 2 of my other emigrant ancestors (Eaker and Mani/Mauney) and also follows several of the other passengers on the Richard and Elizabeth, 1733. (Harold, none of these seem to connect to these Edelmans except the Bauser family, which we already knew about.) There is also a short regional history of the northern Alsace. I have supplemented with information I picked up from other sources, including a recent posting to ROOTS-L requesting information on this family in Maryland. By the way, my confidence that the Lancaster/York Co. Edelman group is the same as those from Baltimore Co., Md. increased when I noticed Jacob Shilling and Frederick Decker mentioned in connnection with both groups. If anyone wants this as an attached file, I can accomodate.
The family arrived on the ship Richard & Elizabeth, 1733. On board were David Edelman (signed with + mark), age 49; Filb (Phillip) Jacob Edelmann (signed name--looks like 2 "n"s to me), age 25; Margaretha Edelman, age 26; Anna Maria Edelman, age 54; Baltasar Edelman, age 4. (I have the complete ship's passenger list--if anyone wants, I can post later.) Bill sent the list later and it is in eg927.
EUROPEAN RECORDS: Hans David Edelmann, citizen in Rott, and wife Anna Margaretha had children:
1. Philip Jacob b. ca. 1708 2. Anna Elisabetha bp. 13 May 1713 (bp.=baptised) 3. Maria Ursela bp. 6 Sept. 1716 4. A daughter b. 9 June 1718, bp. 11 June 1718
Steinselz Reformed KB (church book): Philip Jacob Edelmann, son of David Edelmann of Rott, m. 15 Jan. 1732 Maria Margaretha Wenner, dau. of Simon Wenner of Oberhoffen.
Zweibrucken Manumissions Protocoll, Cleeburg, 1733: David and Philipp Edelmann of Steinselz move with wives and children to Pennsylvania.
AMERICAN RECORDS: First Reformed KB, Lancaster, Pa.: Jacob Edelmann and wife had a son: John David, b. 1 Dec. 1736, bp. 15 May 1737. Sponsors: David Edelmann and wife. Matthew Bauser and wife Anna Elis. nee Edelmann had: 1. Anna Margaret bp. 12 May 1739 2. David bp. 12 May 1739
Baltimore Co., Md. Deed Records, Vol. 2, 1727-1757, John Davis, p. 289, Heritage Books, Inc. 1996
6 Sep 1749, William & Rachel Murphy, planter, of Baltimore Co., MD to Philip Edleman, of Lancaster Co., MD(sic--must be a mistake on the clerk's part??) for 50 pounds, 50 acres on Georges Run. Signed WIlliam (x) Murphy, William Winchester, and Lydia (x) Winchester.
George's Run is very near Lineboro, Md. in present-day Carroll Co.
Same, Vol. 3, 1755-1767
19 Apr 1755, Jacob Shilling Sr. to Philip Eldman, for 40 pounds, 229 acres. Signed Jacob Shilling. Wit: Nicholas Tuxton Gay and John Starkey.
Colonial Maryland Naturalizations: Philip Edleman, Reformed, Baltimore Co., nat. 31 Aug. 1757
Maryland Church Records, Vol. 10, Zion Church, "The German Church", Trinity Lutheran, and Immanuel Lutheran. Zion was in the Manchester, Md. vicinity.
Daniel, son of Gottfried and Maria Elisabetha Welt(in) Laurer, living here, b. 23 Sep. 1760, bp. 2 Oct. 1760. Sponsors: Daniel Edelmann and Maria Born(in), Michell Born's still single daughter.
Anna Maria, dau. of David and Catharine Edelman, bp. 7 Mar. 1762. Sponsors: Frederich and Anna Maria Decker.
>From Vol. 3, York Co, Pa. Church Records of the 18th Century, by Marlene S. Bates and F. Edward Wright
Becker, Anna Maria, daughter of Philip Becker and Julianna bp. 7 Oct. 1759, sponsors: Friedrich Decker and Anna Maria Edelman (Jaboc Lischy's Private Register)
Edelman, Gorg Heinrich of David & Catharina, bp. 24 Mar 1761, sponsors: Gor Heinrich Conrad and Elizabeth (Jacob Lischy's Private Register).
Shilling, Julianna daughter of Jacob Shilling and Elisabeth bp. 14 Feb 1757, sponsors: David and Juliana Edelman (Jacob Lischy's Private Register). [Adam Edelman in Lancaster Co. was m. to a Juliana]
same, Vol. 2
Eva Catherine of Philipp Edelman b. 15 Nov. 1742, bp 17 Dec. 1741(??), sponsors: Barnhart Young and wife. St. Matthew's Lutheran Church.
Would appreciate if anyone can add to this or has any comments. I await more volumes in the Baltimore Co. Deed records!!!
Subject: More on Philip Date: 23 Sep 97 14:03:52 -0500 From: EDDLEMAN-L@rootsweb.com To: Indbio ; from Bill Eddleman
I looked through the book, "The American Addlemans" by Robert P. Addleman last night and found more on Philip Edelman and the younger David in Maryland. As follows:
Baltimore Co. Deeds, 1761, Philip Adleman to George Moyers, Pt. Shillings Folly and Phillipsburg, 243 acres, folio 511.
Baltimore Co. Deeds Register 1659-1800, 5 May 1763, David Idleman to George Myers 140 pounds, Bridgeland--addition to Bridgeland.
[Very interesting that these 2 parcels were apparently sold to the same man. This also pushes records on this David forward in Maryland for 2 more years! It also is the first use of the letter "I" for our name that I have seen. That makes about 34 different spellings I have found in 18th century documents! I wish I had copies of the original deeds--oftentimes relationships are mentioned that don't get copied into abstracts.]
The Daniel Edelman that appears in Maryland is pretty well documented by Robert P. Addleman as having settled on the Addleman spelling after moving to Loudoun Co., VA. He died there and left an estate settlement as: Addlerman, Daniel 1792, intestate.
Harold, YOU REALLY NEED THIS BOOK. Robert has one table that lists all the Edelman/Adelman immigrants he could find from his research and from WHE. He also tries to match them up with know PA locations. WHAT ADDRESS CAN I SEND IT TOO?
Again, I'd love to hear from others on this family.
One more deed record from the Addleman book: from Robert W. Barnes, "Baltimore County Families 1659-1759", p. 404--Philip Adleman to Daniel Adleman, 15 a. Shilling's Folly and part Phillipsburg. No date given for the deed.
Also: from F. Edward Wright, comp., "Inhabitants of Baltimore County, 1692-1763, p. 64--Baltimore Co. Debt. book- 1754--Philip Addleman - Phillips Bough.
Two Michael Edelman fought in the Revolution from Maryland in data that has been coming in.
I have 2 Michael who fought in the Revolution
THE GERMAN IMMIGRATION INTO PENNSYLVANIA THROUGH THE PORT OF PHILADELPHIA FROM 1700 TO 1775, AND THE REDEMPTIONERS. Frank R. Diffenderffer. This important historical study deals with the background of German immigration, especially that of the Palatines, the causes, migration patterns, the leading figures in the movement, and the disposition of the immigrants. Much of the book deals with the redemptioners, those who bound themselves to service as payment for the trip to America. It covers the types of bond servants and evaluates their role in the development of the German settlements, with accounts of their rise, progress, and place in American Society. 328 pp., illus., indexed. (From the Pa.-Germ. Soc. Proc. & Addr., 1900), repr. Balto. 1988. [GP1470] $21.50
Does anyone have this book. If not, I may buy it. Harold Eddleman
Subject: Philip Edleman Date: 27 Sep 97 00:30:48 -0500
I came across this reference in a book and wish to share with the list
Baltimore County, Maryland Deed Records, Vol. Two, 1727-1757 by John Davis pub. by Heritage Books
6 Sep. 1749, William and Rachel Murphy, planter, of Baltimore Co., Maryland to Philip Edleman, of Lancaster Co., Maryland L50, 50 acres... Georges Run. Signed William Murphy, William Winchester, Lydia Winchester.
Message had no identification; who sent it??? says Lancaster MD as in the record above.
The Thirty Years War (1618-1648). by Harold Eddleman
Notes I found on the Internet. Began as German civil war between Protestants and Catholics. When it appeared the Catholics might win, Danes, then Swedes, then French came into the war and fought against the Habsburgs. The power of the Holy Roman Empire was reduced to a shadow. Germany was ruined and half the people died in the struggle. Local soverigns were able to determine their own religion, but individuals had to follow the religion dictated to them by the ruler. Princes united to drive the Swedes out. In this vaccuum, France became the dominant power in Europe. Many modern warfare methods were developed: gunpowder, marching, uniforms, bayonet. Many aspects of modern Europe grew out of the ruins of the war. I believe some Germans fled to Britain and were later enticed to migrate to the American Colonies--I am not sure about that.
Subject: Alsace Eddleman Clan
Date: 28 Sep 97 23:37:02 -0500
Dear Harold, Do you have the following information taken from St. Matthew's Lutheran Church, Hanover, York County, Pa.or have I already given it to you.
Catrina, dau. of Philip Edelman, b. Nov. 15, 1741, bapt. Dec.16, 1741 Sponser: Berhnhart Houx and wife.
Elias, son of (David?) Edelman, b. July 3, 1743, bapt. March 4, 1744 Sponser" Stoffel Schlegel, wife Anna Maria
Canton de Wissembourg (13 communes): Cleebourg, Climbach, Lembach, Niedersteinbach, Oberhoffen-lès-Wissembourg, Obersteinbach, Riedseltz, Rott, Schleithal, Seebach, Steinseltz, Wingen, Wissembourg. -- Taken off the internet by Harold Eddleman
KREKLOW, Rebel L. 580 Dusty Lane, #304, San Marcos, California 92069- eMail address: firstname.lastname@example.org (Lutheran). His query to http://feefhs.org/de/als/alsrl.html follows:
I am seaching for information regarding the HAGELBARGER family. This name was believed to have been changed to HUCKLEBERRY following immigration to America. According to, "A list of German Immigrants to the Ameridcan Colonies from Zweibruecken in the Palatinate" (1750-1771), edited by Dr. Friedrich Krebs, Archvist Speyer-am-Rhein, Germany (which appears in, "Pennsylvania German Immigrants (1709-1786) - List Consolidated from Yearbooks of The Pennsylvania German Folklore Society" edited by Don Yoder - 1984), Benjamin HAGELBARGER with wife and five children of Rott (southwest of Wissembourg), left for America in 1752 with 16 other families (SPECK, DOPPERT, ZIMMERMANN, HARR, WITTERICH, DIERY, DIERY, MUELLER, RUBB, KERN, KERN, KERN, SEYLER, BARTHEL, SCHMITT and HERRMAN).
The family is believed to have been Lutheran. I am trying to ascertain date and port of departure, ship name, and date and port of arrival. Thanks in advance for any help.
This is my query to the same Alsace help page ==> http://feefhs.org/de/als/alsrl.html
Subject: Hanss David Edelmann zu Rott 1733
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 1997 18:33:39 -0700
From: "Harold Eddleman, Ph.D." <email@example.com> Organization: Indiana Biolab
My ancestor Hanss David EDELMANN left Rott, Alsace, in 1733 and arrived at Philadelphia 28 September 1733 on the ship Richard and Elizabeth. For more information about this family in America see http://www.disknet.com/indiana_biolab/eg907.htm. I am seeking information on his parents. I am also interested in the farming and other conditions of life in Rott and Steinseltz in 1733. I have been told many people of 1733 in Rott might have come from France or Switzerland. Does his name of Edelmann indicate where I should look for his parents? In America, he attended Protestant churches. He was age 49 according to the ship list which gives a birthdate of 1684. I want to add a page of details about Rott in 1733 and before. I can read some French and German.
This is the answer Harold Eddleman received:
Webmaster's Note: Since you decline to specifiy the probable religion of your ancestor, it is not possible to suggest whether the FHL microfilms of Rott church records (1701-1942) or Steinseltz (1685-1792) might be useful. FYI, we specialize in family history, not local or regional history, but perhaps others reading this will offer you some thoughts or references. For a history of Alsace and Lorriane on this website, see http://feefhs.org/frl/fr/sc-alhis.html.
Harold Eddleman sent a request for a look up of "Edelmann" in Immigrants from Alsace to USA (a two volume set) and got these two replies:
Subject: Re: Alsace Emigration Book -- Lookup? Date: 26 Oct 97 09:47:42
The surname EDELMAN is noted in the first column of "the ALSACE
IMMIGRATION BOOK" VOL.1. page 62. the page is laid out in columns
last name, first name, birth year, birthplace, date of emigration,, Port
of debarkation, occupation and the source of information with one word,
EDELMAN, HENRY, BD. 1826, MULHOUSE, 6/5/1848, PH, tinmaker? ( hard to read) film
EDELMAN, MARTIN, 1826, BERGHEIM, 1/4/1854, NY, WINEMAKER, FILM
EDELMAN MN KNAB JEANNE, 1823, BERGHEIM, 7/20/1854, NY, BAKER, FILM
Book one does not have Bausser, I will get back to you in another message.
--The second message said no more Edelman and no Bausser in either book.
Here is the second reply:
Subject: Re: Alsace Emigration Book -- Lookup? Date: 27 Oct 97 22:48:50 -0500 From: RobtBehra@aol.com
The Alsace Emigration Book has:
Henry Edelmann, from Mulhouse, with passport dated 5 Jun 1848
Martin Edelmann, from Bergheim, 4 Jan 1854
Jeanne Edelmann (nee Knab), from Bergheim, 20 Jul 1854
Hans Adam Edelman, from Rott, who left sometime about 1731
I am not aware that any of these Edelmann have been found in America. --Harold Eddleman
No Baussers. Depending on how certain you are of the spelling you might consider these other possibilities:
Baushard, Bossard, Bossart, Bossert, Bosshardt, Bosshart
Robert has visited France several times to study his ancestors, he speaks French -- Harold E.
Subject: Philip Eddleman/Idleman Date: 24 Sep 97
The following information is from the William H. Eddleman Collection:
Rent Rolls Scharf Papers: Baltimore County- 25"1" Idlesburg, Surveyed for Philip Idleman the 30th of October, 1757-Beginning at two bounded red oaks standing near the head of a dry gully descending into the main falls of Patapsco River Patented 30th Oct. 1757 11/mo arrears 0:0:11
10"5" Addition to Brigland, surveyed for David Idleman the 10th March 1750 lying and being in Baltimore Cty. Beginning at the end of the south forty six degrees east seventy-six perches line of a tract of land called Brigland Patented the 10th March 1760 6/mo arrears 0:0:21/6
Baltimore County Deeds
1761 Philip Adleman to Daniel Adleman acres folio Pt. Phillipsburg & Shillings folly 150 518
" Philip Adleman to Philip Baker 178 515 New Germany
" Daniel Adleman from Philip Adleman 150 518 Pt. Phillipsburg & Shillings folly
" Philip Adleman to David Adleman 150 522 Pt. Phillipsburg & Shillings folly
" David Adleman from Philip Adleman 150 522 Pt. Phillipsburg & Shillings folly
" Philip Adleman to George Moyer 25 525 Idlesburg
" Philip Adleman from JAcob Shillings Shillings Lot 40 435 Cole Pitt 27 437
1762 David Adleman to Peter Fouble Colchester 33 Coal Pet 77 207 Shillings Lot 44
Hope this helps someone.
-------- Bill Eddleman commented on the above e-message as follows:
WOW! This looks VERY much to me like Philip was conveying land to sons, sons-in-law, or others. With this posting and mine from the other day, we now have a David selling land in Maryland at the EXACT time frame that the David who married Catherine would have gone to NC. As far as I know, we have now assembled the largest collection of these deeds since WHE--although it looks to me like he even missed some of them.
Harold, we need to get the original deeds! Again, we can probably get these through LDS. We might also either find or hire a local contact, or see if the County Clerk will copy deeds. There is just a chance a relationship will be mentioned in at least one of them.
Harold Eddleman sent this query to an Alsace moderated list http://feefhs.org/de/als/alsrl.html
My ancestor Hanss David EDELMANN left Rott, Alsace, in 1733 and arrived at Philadelphia 28 September 1733 on the ship Richard and Elizabeth. For more information about this family in America see http://www.disknet.com/indiana_biolab/eg907.htm. I am seeking information on his parents. I am also interested in the farming and other conditions of life in Rott and Steinseltz in 1733. I have been told many people of 1733 in Rott might have come from France or Switzerland. Does his name of Edelmann indicate where I should look for his parents? In America, he attended Protestant churches. He was age 49 on the ship list which gives a calculated birthdate of 1684. I want to add a page of details about Rott in 1733 and before. I can read some French and German.
The moderator replied:
Since you decline to specifiy the probable religion of your ancestor, it is not possible to suggest whether the FHL microfilms of Rott church records (1701-1942) or Steinseltz (1685-1792) might be useful. FYI, we specialize in family history, not local or regional history, but perhaps others reading this will offer you some thoughts or references. For a history of Alsace and Lorriane on this website, see http://feefhs.org/frl/fr/sc-alhis.html.
Subject: Anna Elisabeth Bauser Date: 10 Oct 97
Harold and cousins,
I don't have the record at hand, but one of the Lancaster, Pa. churches had birth/baptismal records for 2 children of Matthew and Anna Elisabeth Bauser. In one, Anna Elisabeth was listed as nee Edelman. The second child was named David, with David Edelman as one sponsor for the baptism. This is not really proof that she was a daughter of our David Edelman, but is strongly suggestive.
Rober Behra replied:
Kleeburg is the German spelling of Cleebourg, which is a town of 584 people (1990 population) 7 km. southwest of Wissembourg. It is in the canton and arrondissement of Wissembourg, and departement of Bas-Rhin (northern Alsace). It was largely a Calvinist town, although there were also Catholic and Lutheran residents. You should be able to order church and civil records for Cleebourg on microfilm from Salt Lake City, through your local LDS Family History Center. (The Lutheran residents of Cleebourg attended church in Rott, about 2 km. to the northeast.
While Schylmeyer has no connection with Edelmann, Behra's comments about Rott are useful.